SedonaEye.com columnist Eddie Maddock
Sedona AZ (November 7, 2014) – The final Regular City Council Meeting, prior to the seating of the newly elected, is on Wednesday, November 12, 2014, where a last ditch effort to purchase creek side property will again be discussed.
The three properties for consideration at this time as taken from the Council Agenda are:
Chavez Crossing – Current USFS Campground Site
Chavez Crossing is located off State Highway 179 at Oak Creek Cliffs Drive, across from the Poco Diablo Resort. It is owned by the USFS and currently operated as a reservation-only overnight campground, not open to daytime recreation or for general public use. The total parcel is approximately 37 acres and is bisected by Highway 179.
The western portion of the site (west of Highway 179) is approximately 27 acres and the other approximately 10 acres – of the same parcel located across Highway 179 (east of 179) – consists of a very steep hillside, unusable for any type of development. Of the 27 acres on the west side, approximately six of those make up the current campground site.
To the south, the parcel quickly turns into a steep hill, rendering the top of the site inaccessible from the campground below. At the top of that hill there is a flat several acres accessible off Highway 179, and a small unofficial parking lot trail head used by hikers who traverse the steep hill to a portion of the creek south of the campground.
Although this is all one large parcel of USFS land, the City has only discussed use of the campground portion of the site. There have not been discussions regarding acquiring the entire parcel, although that may be further studied should the USFS support it. The smaller campground portion of the site has direct creek access and already has basic infrastructure in place, including a small parking area, vault restrooms, picnic tables, drinking water and cooking grills.
In addition to the attractive location of the site just off a major highway, and the fact that it is partially developed and has relatively few development challenges, staff has also identified this site as being suitable for possible conversion to a Day Use public park, due to the fact that the campsites within this property are located within a flood way.
USFS staff is willing to continue to work with the City to evaluate this site and the possibility of converting its use to create a creek side public park and to consider the City’s acquisition and operation of that park. It has recommended, that should the City of Sedona wish to pursue this property, we begin by conducting public scoping in 2015.
Should the City Council wish to continue to pursue this property, the City would need to fund the scoping at a cost of $15,000. The USFS does not have these funds available.
Sedona City Council will seat newly elected mayor and members in November 2014
Schnebly Hill Road Community Focus Area
Several creek side properties exist along Schnebly Hill Road just north of the Schnebly Hill roundabout. Most of the ten or so key properties in this area are residential, with the exception of an RV Park located at the northernmost portion. There are several undeveloped parcels many of which are entirely or almost entirely in the flood way. The majority of the area is flat with good access off Schnebly Hill Road.
This entire area has not met its full development potential and, as such, has been identified in the Sedona Community Plan as a Community Focus Area (CFA). As a result of that designation, the City and the neighborhood anticipate conducting specific area planning activities to identify and plan for the most suitable land uses in anticipation of and prior to future development.
While there are no current sellers of property who have been identified, as generally outlined in the community plan, the neighbors have worked together to develop preliminary concepts for re-development that will be the basis for CFA planning. These preliminary plans include the possible addition of small retail, bed and breakfast type lodging, age-in-place housing and or other potential non-residential uses. These changes will require some re-zoning. Because the neighborhood/property owners are so far along with their planning efforts, staff is recommending this be the next active CFA planning area, which could begin as soon as the beginning of 2015.
As the specific area planning is done and eventually the property owners seek new zoning, it is possible that creek-side open space/park space and or a “creek-walk” pathway may be able to be programmed into that focus area planning and, ultimately, acquired through a combination of property purchase by the City and or acquisition of property through the community benefit contributions which must be met when obtaining city entitlements such as zoning.
The neighborhood/property owners have made it clear through discussions with staff that they favor pedestrian only access, should some type of creek-walk or small creek-side park be developed here. The neighbors are very unlikely to support anything that is developed as a large park or a destination that requires vehicular access.
Oak Creek development under consideration
The Preserve at Oak Creek – Uptown
The Preserve at Oak Creek, located at SR 89A and Art Barn Road totals 21.5 acres and is made up of 13 separate parcels. There are several small vacant mobile homes and an office building with a graded parking area associated with the previous Hawkeye trailer park. There is also a large single family home currently occupied by the property caretaker. The property has approximately 2,130 feet of creek frontage. The property is undeveloped but had prior approvals for a large mixed use development that never materialized. That zoning has since expired. For any development to occur on the property a rezoning application would need to be approved or the property reverted back to its original zoning classification through legislative action by the Planning and Zoning Commission and City Council
The latest unofficial purchase price estimate for this property was $8.5 million but the property is not currently listed for sale. Staff has not inquired further regarding owner interest in selling. This property is included in this report not for consideration for purchase, but due to its potential for working with a future developer to incorporate a creek park or other creek access into a future development, as part of the required rezoning process. At 21.5 acres, the property is larger than is necessary for a creek access park, and given its high price tag, waiting and partnering with a future developer may make more sense than an attempted City acquisition and seeking of a private partner to develop the unneeded portion.
This property is located at the upper end of Uptown, in one of the highest if not the highest traffic area in the City particularly on busy weekends. Traffic in this location can back up for many miles in each direction and for the City to develop a recreational amenity that will put additional vehicles in this location, traveling in and out of the property, would exacerbate an already difficult situation for our merchants, residents and guests. Staff would recommend pursuing the other two options prior to actively pursuing this property for a creek park.
City of Sedona Arizona has a population of approximately 10K of which about 6K are considered year round residents.
Financial Ability to Purchase Property
Currently, the City has approximately $1,600,000 in Park Development Impact Fees available for land acquisition that could be used to acquire any of the above-listed parcels. Any purchases in excess of the available impact fees would require utilization of the City’s reserves or re-prioritization of projects already included in the CIP and funded through reserves, such as streets and drainage improvements.
The City does have additional debt capacity to finance land acquisitions, however, it would be necessary to identify a revenue stream in the budget to retire the additional debt service. Interest rates are still very favorable for borrowing.
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This is GREAT news. In the heat of the summer we LOVE to day-trip to Sedona and look forward to a picnic and wade in Oak Creek without having to drive through the traffic to Slide Rock! YIPPEE!
If I read this correctly – the Lame Duck Mayor (and his lofty legacy dreams) as well as the other Lame Duck Council members- are once again trying to recreate the wheel and abdicate their first and most primary responsibilities of health, safety and welfare for our citizens. First the almost out of time Mayor wanted to expand commercial adventures out at the “bird ponds” (aka: Waste Water Treatment Plant = the potty ponds) and since that isn’t boding too well he/they have made the switch back to his/their other first choice!
Don’t any of them understand the rights of private property owners who live on the Creek? Don’t any of them understand the miles and miles of public access to Oak Creak north and south of Sedona?
Don’t any of them understand this ain’t New York where entitlements are just the norm?
This is Sedona, a town of under 10,000 people who all have full access to the Creek with just a short drive and the enjoyment of either State or Federal access to the creek.
When does the Lame Duck Council and (hopefully) new Council realize and fully understand their legislative responsibility is to provide – first and foremost – the Health, Safety and Welfare issues necessary to improve and maintain our community?
If, for one flying moment, they think a City owned public creek park supersedes the above needs, then I must be living in la-la land and the aliens have truly taken over our little wonting (of the basic necessities) town!
Next, in order to pay for their self serving play party’s – they will want to put into play special tax districts or a new bond to cover expenses or who knows how else they will want to pay for all their pretty pony wants – oh, just remembered, City Property taxes!
All that for a “free” trip to the creek to get toes wet?
The “New Voices” haven’t even taken over and it’s already started, depriving those of us they perceive to be wealthy of minimal necessities such as roads that don’t give us flat tires and adequate drainage to prevent flooding. “New Voices” will be a continuation of what’s being put into motion here. Taking on projects they know will add to traffic congestion and worse yet that are in a flood plain. Source of funding be damned!
Staff has written in black and white that this is fact and not fiction so enough with your “micro-management” you foolish and uncaring people. The “true” elite have succeeded in their manipulation to take full control of our destiny and if this is any indication it’s looking pretty bleak.
Another self serving, hate filled rant by Sharlett. At least your consistent!!
Andy were you getting flat tires at.?. Were do the roads need attention to your satisfaction? I see alot of drainage work going on in West Sedona..
Are you just jumping on the bandwagon and enjoying a hate fuel rant?
TALK ABOUT FINANCIAL INSANITY….
(1) Since the $1.6 million in Park Development Impact Fees must be spent on the acquisition of parkland, this means the future funds required to construct, implement, operate and maintain the creekwalk, or creekside park as the case may be, will have to come from the General Fund operating budget in all probability. BTW, the City admits it does not have the funds needed for developing the “Old Ranger Station” property on Brewer Road it confiscated from a private property owner last year through a condemnation proceeding. At one City Council meeting, the tab for just ridding the buildings of asbestos was mentioned as a cool $1 million.
(2) The City’s General Fund budgeted expenditures have increased 13% this fiscal year over last, mainly due to the $623,500 additional pork approved for the Chamber of Commerce. The City’s Budgeted Expenditures are $38,385,154 while its Total Estimated Revenues are only $27,790,280. The final budget is a 6.2% increase from last fiscal year. Reserves/savings set aside by much earlier City Councils are being plundered again.
(3) Page 22 of the City budget* indicates in two years time there will be no reserves left to fund [non-sewer] capital projects. It states other funding sources and/or a debt financing strategy must be pursued. A few months ago the Mayor indicated there are $20 million or more in drainage problems needing funding and fixing (Video News, Sedona.Biz). Then there are the many shot streets in the older areas of Sedona, the new sidewalks that are S.O.L., etc.
(4) The City’s bond debt is approximately $47 million currently. According to the Arizona Department of Revenue’s Report of Bonded Indebtedness (Page 12), Sedona has the 7th highest per capita debt of AZ’s 91 cities. 15% of the City’s revenue goes for Debt Service. The total Debt Service amount due and owing this fiscal year is $5,983,947. So terrific to learn the City’s annual Debt Service obligations are maxed out, yet additional indebtedness is not off the table as should be the case.
Source: Fiscal Year 2014-2015 Budget Document, Finance Dept. website.
@west Sedona Resident: Small minds only seem to want to stay within their (uneducated) narrow viewpoints and don’t seem to realize or understand that they can and perhaps should expand their tunnel vision view of the world in order to attempt to see both sides of any issue.
Instead they just continue to ignore real facts such as those provided by both Eddie M and Jean J. Instead they seem to become smaller minded rather than stretching their minds to become educated.
I didn’t see any rants here – other than yours.
Why would anybody make it a higher priority to take road and drainage funds to create a park or walkway in a flood zone? Why don’t those people who are so insistent start their own fund raising drive to bring their dreams to fruition? Why even consider putting the financial burden on those of us who just want to live our lives in peace and quiet without frills or thrills?
One thing that shouldn’t be overlooked here is the factual transparency offered by City Staff, and that should be commended.
All locations being considered, including Lomacasi which was not recommended, are in the flood plain, will exacerbate traffic congestion, and financing must be obtained from existing capital improvement projects and/or other methods of implementing new revenue sources.
The USFS doesn’t have $15,000 to open up a scoping process. But Sedona does? Oh, “But it’s only $15,000.” How many times have we heard that before?
Based on the information provided by Staff, if this city council continues to pursue this lifetime commitment at the expense of Sedona tax payers they are being reckless and totally remiss of the commitment to the office to which they were elected, that being to first and foremost uphold the premise of Health, Safety, and Welfare. A creek walk/park by no means qualifies. Period!
@west Sedona Resident:
Your ranting sounds suspiciously like the socialist/Marxist diatribe of Jessica Williamson/Barbara Litrell/Angela LeFevre. And, beware, you are no match for Sharlett and JeanJ.
@west Sedona Resident:
Or, to put it another way now that I think about it, you should be careful where you carry or leave your socialist brown bag, because the three ladies in the persons of Eddie Maddock, Sharlett and JeanJ will eat your lunch.
Yea Ok Rick….
Not even sure what that is nor do I care..
Nothing you ever ranted about here has gained any traction except with the 8-10 people here who suffer from paranoia…
Not impressed with you overblown sense of self…
If your gonna cry people about roads in need of repairs, name them!!! We’re are these imaginary roads…
As far as drainage, I see them doing alot of drainage work in West Sedona… What the hell you talking about……
BTW….
All you smart people here::: Didn’t see any if you names on the ballot… Guess it’s easier to take shots from the sidelines…
Thank you, Rick, for including me in your second “threesome.” The only problem is the first three ladies have the ability to cast votes where they count.:-)
To West Sedona Resident:
FYI I posted my comment re J. Rick Normand’s contribution prior to having read what you wrote about voting privileges that actually decide the outcome of these really critical matters. You, of course, are correct on that issue and which I believe was acknowledged in my above remark.
@west Sedona Resident:
You say “Not impressed with you overblown sense of self…” and
“Guess it’s easier to take shots from the sidelines…” So, let me get this straight…you, yourself, have a great sense-of-self when you’re semi-literate and don’t even understand what a “socialist/Marxist” is and you think you’re not taking shots from the sidelines while you’re hiding behind your anonymous handle at this site? You are, indeed, a very misguided person. Oh, BTW, to “get traction” as this site you have to be at least capable of writing an intelligent sentence with correctly spelled words!
Rick
“AS This Site” is not proper English… Think you ment At this site… An investigative reporter like yourself would of surely caught that..
@west Sedona Resident:
Yes, I put a typo into my statement to find out if you pay attention at all. So, congratulations since you’ve demonstrated that you can note details and nitpick. If that’s the case, though, then let’s talk serious city business. You said “If your gonna cry people about roads in need of repairs, name them!!! We’re are these imaginary roads…” Imaginary roads?” OK, how about Airport Rd.? The City is well aware, due to consulting reports, that the shoulders are collapsing which will result in the ultimate collapse of the road into Saddlerock Estates below and cut off airport access as well as business access up on the mesa, which would be an economic calamity for Sedona not to mention a multi-million dollar lawsuit liability. And, how about Mule Deer Rd. between Rodeo and Andante and CoronadoTrail near the head of Navahopi Rd.? Crack repairs don’t even work anymore on these streets. In fact, there are better than a dozen such roads in Sedona in a state of serious disrepair. Also, there are serious drainage problems around town beyond just west Sedona. Apparently, it’s just the big details you choose to be too careless to notice. Let’s cease with the squabbling. You shot your mouth off without doing your homework. You have no idea what you’re talking about, not that anybody could understand your semi-literate rantings, and you got belligerent with three ladies who do all their research homework in consummate fashion before they speak! Just who do you think you are? (Of course, I know you don’t have the courage to answer that!)
Aside from Airport Rd, let me take at the others that u consider in need of repair… Btw that’s all you came up with?! The way you bitch and moan you make it sound like its a personal hazard taking ones life in thier hands to get around!!
Serious drainage problems around town!!?? Haven’t heard of any flood/drainage problems/ damage lately…
Details and Nitpick!!?? You must be referring to your band of merry complainers. and finger pointers
@west Sedona Resident:
I don’t claim to have the smartest of “Smarts” but I sure do know how to spell and keep learning… that you don’t.
My take is that J Rick Normand just called you out as either playing a poor grammar game for your own purposes – or – you don’t understand spelling and grammar – or just what is your purpose?
In reviewing all the posts above, I do find actual facts that I have been able to verify – over emotional fictions that you have posted with no verification.
So I am wondering where your fact based comments are derived from? If you have real facts that repudiate Eddie and Jean J. and Sharlett – where are they and when will you share them with the rest of us.
Think that is a very fair question. Ball is in your court @west Sedona Resident:
Don’t care to repudiate the facts As They See It..
What I am saying is this cast of characters have never had any thing positive to say about anything relating to Sedona government… I trust they hate government period!
The tone is most always bitter, hostile, condensing from everything and everyone from the Chamber of Commerce to cutting down a tree..
If they so love showing us how smart they are and how wrong everyone else is why is it I did not see one of these names on the election ballot..
Surely anyone of this cast of characters would Straighten out Sedona in short order..
The voters have voted and those from the VOCAL minority lost once again..
So as the rants continue all will be treated suspect until the time I see the Smart ones on the ballot..
@west Sedona Resident:
Think about it…you are the ultimate self-indicted fool. If you demand that the “Smart” ones run for office, and you believe that you’re not a hypocrite nor a simpleton, then why wasn’t your name on the ballot in the last election since you must believe yourself to be one of the “Smart” ones? Face it Man, you can’t even handle the minimally deductive logic necessary to understand the propositions on an election ballot.
@J. Rick Normand – As I see it, West Sedona Resident’s name wasn’t on the ballot since he/she has no real identity. Or is that true? Could it be that this anonymous person was, in fact, on a ballot and is either presently seated on the city council or soon to be sworn in?
And as far as nothing positive about city government, WSR reads only what he/she chooses. How about re-reading comment made by James Harrington who clearly compliments city staff on their candid and truthful observations of the problems a creek walk/park will create for the city. Specifically, (1) all locations are in flood plains; (2) adding an attraction like this will increase traffic jams; (3) there is no money for such nonsense unless at the expense of road repair/maintenance, addressing serious drainage problems, or other means of new funding sources such as city property taxes, special improvement districts, etc.
Staff is given assignments, comes to council, presents facts, and council goes against recommendations. How many times has this happened? West Sedona Resident’s probably lost tracj if he/she can even count that high.
To all SedonaEye Readers:
Relative to the recent dangerously naive comments of New Sedona Voices and West Sedona Resident at this site, who suggest that government power should trump private property rights and citizen’s rights to voice demands for fiscally sane and efficient government spending of taxpayer funds, I have just learned that these STUPENDOUS spending items appear on the City Council Agenda for discussion this Wednesday, Nov 12 at 4:30pm. What you are about to read is precisely what happens when people like New Sedona Voices and West Sedona Resident NEVER stand up for fiscal sanity and citizen property rights~
REGULAR BUSINESS
a. AB 1871
Discussion/possible action regarding the award of a contract for
construction of the Wastewater Reclamation Plant (WWRP) A+ Upgrades Project to Currier Construction, Inc. in the amount of $4,271,789, and award of a Professional Services Contract for Construction Administration and Inspection [and] (CA & I) Services to Carollo Engineers, Inc. in the amount of $267,013.
(5:00-5:30 p.m. 30 minutes)
b. AB 1765
Discussion/possible direction regarding the City’s interest in the
acquisition of creek-side property for use as a public park. Staff will discuss the pros and cons of several potential sites including sites in the far northern portion of Uptown, the Schnebly Hill Road area, and at the Chavez Crossing campground, and seek direction regarding next steps and project scope should the City Council wish to pursue the development of a creek park or other community access to the creek. (5:30-6:30 p.m. 60 minutes)
On April 13, 2013, then Vice Mayor Cliff Hamilton emailed me and said this about the $2.3M the City had just spent using debt proceeds, or soon would spend, on the Wetlands Preserve Project:
“The habitat will continue to develop over the next decade as the trees grow and that aspect of vertical dimension develops. The city will let a contract this month to complete the public use components such as the parking area, restrooms, picnic tables and ramadas, interp. info panels and garbage cans, etc. That will make this a fully functonal 30 acre park that is unique among such places in northern AZ.” You’ll notice that it was projected that it would take TEN years for the project to pan out so that a birder’s vacation paradise would accrue to Sedona.
Now, the City’s current Council, amongst its last acts before leaving office, is possibly moving to spend another $4.59 million to STOP birders from “endangering” themselves at the Wetlands Preserve. What the hell was this whole massive spending project for in the first place, then? And, where will this money come from…more debt, of course.THIS IS FISCAL MADNESS!
@Marty:
Marty, your surmisal may be right on target!
To all SedonaEye Readers:
If you’ll go to the link below you can get the Audobon Society’s terse reaction to the Waste Water Treatment Plant discussion item at the Nov 12 Council meeting:
To all SedonaEye Readers:
ALERT CONCERNING SEDONA WETLANDS PRESERVE
Hello NAAS,
I just spoke with Charles Mosley, Sewage Treatment Plant Manager, regarding a fence he is proposing to build around the perimeter of the six evaporation ponds at the Sedona Wetlands Preserve. The fence will be 6′ high and 2200′ length (See attached). This will effectively cut off all wildlife access. The only other access would be for wildlife to cross Hwy. 89A which could be disastrous for motorists and wildlife. No accidents, nor near accidents have occurred at the Wetlands with pedestrians, service vehicles or police dept. vehicles. They simply want to control people from going out of the designated “City Park” area. Charles continues to claim it is a safety issue for pedestrians.
It also cuts off all possibilities to the back ponds which we hope in the future would be accessible to birders. Not only will the fence eliminate wildlife’s ability to obtain water it gives the public the sense that this is not a welcoming place. It would be likened to birding in prison. The expense is excessive and an example of another wasteful use of taxpayer’s money. No other sewage treatment facility open to the public and wildlife is fenced off in this manor. The sewage treatment facility’s operations are already fenced off. The large holding pond is already fenced off. We do not need another fence at this City Park.
Time is of the essence because the project bid has already been awarded and construction on the fence is proposed to start this month.
The Sedona City Council meeting is Nov. 12, 4:30 pm in the council chambers. We are not on the agenda because of this late information. However, if we could get as many local citizens as possible who believe this fence is unnecessary, and a waste of taxpayer dollars to attend this council meeting we might still be effective in stopping this project. The more people who show up and are willing to speak during the public comment period the more effective it will be.
Thank you for your attention to this matter,
Dena Greenwood
dena@jaysbirdbarn.com
928-203-5700
@J.Rick Normand: But it ain’t THEIR money! Sedona is the laughing stock of the Verde Valley and that’s NO joke.
With many of our businesses getting next to free billing at your regional chamber of commerce plus the new scam of promoting coalition art groups, we are living the dream. Thanks, Sedona city council, for sharing your apparently unlimited wealth.
Wait until they unveil their plans for developing the “Wetlands Preserve.” It will be interesting to see what the Red Rock/Dry Creek Land Use planners have to say about that one. Stay tuned.
JeanJ Wrong on both counts
You said, “Old Ranger Station” property on Brewer Road it confiscated from a private property owner last year through a condemnation proceeding.
You also stated, “At one City Council meeting, the tab for just ridding the buildings of asbestos was mentioned as a cool $1 million.
Oh please at least get your facts straight. “The Old Ranger Station property was not taken by condemnation” in fact the city paid cash and above fair market value in a deal worked out with the owner. The property was zoned for parkland and the buildings are protected as historic landmarks. The real value was almost 0,unless you want to own a park.
You also use an old trick to make a point “the tab for just ridding the buildings of asbestos was mentioned as a cool $1 million”. “Was mentioned” this is not a fact, and not even close to a real number you just use it to make whatever point you are trying to make.
Wrong on both counts,
Steve Segner
And yes I vote and live in in Sedona
Interesting dialogues found on this site, thanks Sedonatimes! We love ya!
Another interesting “fact” about the Brewer Road acquisition is the amount the city paid for the property was above appraisal.
Smells like, sounds like, rants like “toms @ west Sedona Resident:.
Anyone that doesn’t go along with your city staff agenda, you name call. Wouldn’t it be best for you to put your negative rants and name calling to better use? How about an anger management class. The only bitter, hostile, posts come from you.
Great to see people using their real names and speaking up. Thank you j. Rick, Eddie, Jean & Scarlett. The fabulous four.
@Sedona Flatlander, on this issue (Creek Walk/Park) I must agree with those who made favorable comments about City Staff.
As the notice (theme of the above article) specifically cites the council agenda for the meeting on Wednesday (11/12) and staff report, the three negatives have been reviewed several times throughout this dialog. Factual information and good common sense evaluation from Staff.
Will the City Council listen?
More on financial craziness: The City made a formal offer of $520,000 for the “Old Ranger Station” property on Brewer Road, which the owner, Surrey Vacation Resorts, did not accept. There were at least two Council meetings in September and October 2013 about condemnation. The February 2014 Council Minutes about purchasing the property very conveniently failed to include one word about the matter, even thought it was formally agendized. According to past internet postings, the property was reported as being condemned. However, since the City paid more than the $520,000 appraisal it received, perhaps the Council decided to maneuver around condemnation. It would be great if the City’s Minutes in February 2014 didn’t contain a giant omission. Then there wouldn’t be confusion…….And, if the real value of the property was almost 0, then how come the City’s and the owner’s appraisals both came in at over 1/2 mil?
When Kevin Snyder was at City Hall–the City Community Development Director guy who came from Washington State and returned not long after he was hired–Councilor Martinez mentioned the $1 million cost to rid the buildings at the “Old Ranger Station” of asbestos.
The bottom line is the City Council does not have the needed funds to construct, implement, operate and maintain the parks it insists upon buying. These ‘minor details’ will cost more than the price of the parks themselves and no doubt be accomplished at the expense of Sedona taxpayers.
Rick….
Oh my God…. Sharing information about the potential impact of a fence around the sewage ponds!!??
Aren’t those who enjoy those areas ENTiTlEMENT takers!!??
What do you say Jean Jenks and Sharrlet!!?
Rick what’s going on, you softening up a little.?!
I think a fence is a bad idea least of which has to do with money..
Steve S… Thanks for proving my point about Jean J…
Thank you @ Mary S. you are right. I misspoke. I hope cc will listen.
@west Sedona Resident:
I’m not softening up at all, Jessica!
Oh Eddie – you’ve such a sweet face and smart mind. How on earth do you bring out these comments from the new voices in town? Is it true that the old voices (minority who voted against owning 89A) are really so stupid? Hardly! seems to me it’s the new voices such as West Sedona Resident and the Toms, and New Sedona Voices etc who just don’t give a crap about facts like you and Jean and J Rick and Sharlett do.
Hey Mz Jessica – In my opinion aren’t you in fact West Sedona Resident?
So, Mr. Segner: ya really think you caught Jean J in a mistake? Suggest you look back at your record of saying “Trust Me, Trust ME, TRUST ME”!
So Steve S – why should any of us trust you? Are you saying that you approve of spending money on a creek park that we can’t find funds to complete and which may cause property taxes or new special districts etc.?
As you admit that you live and vote in Sedona – how come you didn’t run for any Council seat – instead you paid money to get your surrogates elected?
@west Sedona Resident:
Nope, I’m not getting soft at all, but thanks for asking Jessica!
@ J. Rick
You absolutely nailed it about “Jessica” our council member. Wouldn’t You think that a Councilor reading this article and leaving messages would speak appropriately about the issues, instead of hostilely attacking the people and issues just as She does while sitting in Council.
I’ve been quietly reading through these comments and have a theory that I believe to be correct: Sedona Eye has allowed Us the forum here to communicate our thoughts openly. In doing so We find that We aren’t the only ones that don’t like what’s going on in Our City. The Red Rock News would never let Us know what’s really going on, but Here We share information, ideas and sometimes tempers. We have some very intelligent people here sharing facts, research, history, etc. What’s more dangerous to any governing force then people joining together ‘Thinking’.
Now if I were someone that had the City and it’s money in My pocket, the last thing I want are people thinking, gathering and finding out, so I’m going to throw a few cogs in the wheel, hence My Puppets. Say like maybe West Sedona Resident, Steve Segner, My newly purchased Scott Jablow, and a few others to cause an upset and distraction on this Site, so that the comments will be veered in a hostile direction and people won’t focus on the subjects. I can then attack the people I believe to be the most threatening with their facts, and throw a shadow on them with the others. And while I’m at it I will probably attack anyone else that comes into the conversation with intelligent thoughts as to keep them silent.
Someone wrote a comment here in some article a while back words that are still ringing in My ears, it read “First they ignore you, Then they laugh at you, Then they attack”. They have ignored Us, then We were laughed at, and now They’re attacking Us into hopeful silence. Thank goodness for Eddie, Jean, J. Rick and others who refuse to be intimidated because We are really going to need Them and Their input with this new Mayor and Council.
Sorry about not using My real name, but I am afraid of retaliation, maybe Rio can tell You about that type of thing.
@Ellie G. It doesn’t so much seem to be what I write that attracts such a myriad of comments, as the original subjects generally seem to go bye-bye during the course of discussion. Much like that game played back in the day where people sit in a row and at one end a story is whispered into the ear of the next person and then passed on down the line. By the time it reaches the other end, well, the original tale is not to be recognized.
At any rate, agree or disagree with other opinions, the exchange is generally exhilarating although in my own opinion those pointing the hatred finger might benefit by practicing what they preach. Just a thought.
Have a great day. It’s beautiful out there for the time being.
Eddie Maddock
PS = Council meeting tomorrow, Wednesday, Nov. 11th, 4:30 PM. Attend in person or view online or Cable Channel 4.
DATE OF COUNCIL MEETING SHOULD BE NOV. 12 (not 11)
SORRY.
ESM
Call the County about the fence. Call the EPA about the fence. Call Phoenix about the fence. Call the Dept of Ag about the fence. Somebody had to ram through approval from the County for this fence because there are environmental impact questions and approvals needed for runoff, animal migration, wildlife, birding and more. BTW THE SILENCE IS DEAFENING FROM KSB & RAYNOR’S SIERRA CLUB – whose pocket are you in on city council? Contact powerful groups in AZ that will attack this fence. Get them on the phone. Get a lawyer to write a letter. THIS is what happens in Sedona when money that corrupted DORR – because DORR wants power more than quality of Sedona life. Transparency is not the Democratic Party way these days, disgusting at that is. The people of Sedona deserve better.
@Thinking
Your evaluation is BRILLIANT. How sad but true that it becomes necessary to refrain from using true identity due to fear of retaliation. Another FACT that some other “unnamed” people fail to recognize.
The well crafted contribution you offer is, indeed, a keeper for many reasons.
Thank you.
@Thinking,
I thoroughly agree with “In Appreciation.” Your synopsis is well conceived and written. You could be a great asset to this community. It is, indeed, a shame that you have fear retaliation (a fear that I wholeheartedly understand)…which you WILL have leveled at you if you disclose your name, I will confirm.
It was one of my idols, Mahatma Gandhi, who said “First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.” Relative to this adage, I just want you to know, because I do speak out with supporting facts and logic and dare to use my real name when doing so, I’ve experienced, as confirmed in local court and police records, a threat against my physical person and life for writing about true skeletons in the closet of one of our new Councilors. The intent behind the threat was to stop me from writing the truth here at the Eye. That’s a fact! I am quite sure that one of my adversaries in this very thread (comments to this article by Eddie) is associated with the person(s) who threatened me. Obviously, these threats didn’t have the intended effect hoped for by the perpetrator(s).
Carl, start here–
http://www.AZGOV@AZ.gov
(602) 542-4331
Welcome Scott Jablow to Sedona city council.
Sound like a bunch of crybabies and paranoid conspiracy theorists..
Why would anyone elected official listen to anything from the smart vocal minority when according to you all, it’s all wrong.. Plus you lost the election and none of your names where on the ballot..
Some on here have been bellyaching on this site for years and years and years about any and all things government!!
Yet life goes on.
No one is trying to shut down your little hate blog..
You all sound ridiculous
BTW Rick I’m not Jennifer or even a women for that matter…
Sure she has better things to do then go round and round on this blog…
In reviewing the numerous really interesting comments, something occurred to me. If, by chance, at the meeting on Wednesday (November 12th) when discussing the proposed development of a creek park/walk, this city council hangs their hat on the alleged “need” as being in the Community Plan (if indeed it is) then these seven people need to be reminded. The Introduction to the recently adopted revision of the Sedona Community Plan starts out:
“The Sedona Community Plan (Plan) is an expression of Sedona citizens’ vision of their community and is the City’s “general plan” required by the State of Arizona. The Plan proposes desired conditions for the future of the community. It is intended to guide future growth, not to regulate it.”
The operative words here are encompassed in the last sentence of the partial quote I’m offering: “It is intended to guide future growth, NOT TO REGULATE IT.”
Therefore, City Council, kindly spare citizens of Sedona the boring option you have to drone on and on about justification of spending money not readily available for something that is not a Community Plan REQUIREMENT in any sense of the word. This also will apply to future endeavors to place “Community Plan” recommendations over and above necessities which factually benefit health, safety, and welfare for the public in general instead of frills for your elite to meet.
Thank you.
Question for J. Rick Normand:
Am I missing something? Did you ever in any of your comments refer to “West Sedona resident” as “Jennifer?” Could it be that “Jessica” and “Jennifer” are one and the same?
And just whose credibility is being questioned here?
So how do elections work? Seem to me you take the time to talk to everyone running, you ask them questions, and then you support the people you like and need help with campaiign contributions. I liked and helped everyone running except one person.
For this I am painted as evil, people get a life and start using your real names.
As for the creek side walk the city just asked staff to do some research to help the council understand there options, that is the job of staff.
And Eddie you would have know about the forrest service building if you had done your resurch or actually went to council meeting or worked on any city committees.
Steve segner