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	Comments on: Sedona Council Vote Based on Poor Research and Weak Oversight	</title>
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	<description>Local News From All Points of View</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 27 Aug 2013 02:42:08 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>
		By: Dan, Sedona		</title>
		<link>https://sedonaeye.com/sedona-council-vote-based-on-poor-research-and-weak-oversight/comment-page-1/#comment-26157</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dan, Sedona]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Aug 2013 02:42:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://sedonaeye.com/?p=32102#comment-26157</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[very nice post, we certainly enjoy this website, carry on]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>very nice post, we certainly enjoy this website, carry on</p>
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		<title>
		By: Terrie Frankel		</title>
		<link>https://sedonaeye.com/sedona-council-vote-based-on-poor-research-and-weak-oversight/comment-page-1/#comment-26126</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Terrie Frankel]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Aug 2013 17:52:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://sedonaeye.com/?p=32102#comment-26126</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Now that our highly paid upper management City Staff  controls this town &#039;lock, stock and barrel&#039;- with City Council&#039;s blessings and no &quot;pesky open meeting laws&quot; to deal with - not to mention any &quot;annoying transparency&quot; - a more appropriate name for the Citizens Engagement Committee would be the Citizens Elimination Committee....I watched too as the many outstanding speeches and pleas to Council made by our most revered citizens were completely ignored. Some Commissions needed to be eliminated, some tweaked, however, the Draconian &#039;axing&#039; of so many Commissions, particularly dealing with arts and history is a sad day in Sedona history... One little caveat... If I recall correctly, City Attorney Mike Goimarac said repeatedly during the meeting that the Commissions could NOT be dissolved until the Ordinances creating them were rescinded. When our Mayor Rob Adams deserted the meeting prematurely, the vote to rescind the Ordinances ended up being tied 3-3, thus resulting in defeat. Rob could have saved the Commissions right then and there with a &#039;no&#039; vote. So, technically, until those Ordinances are rescinded, the Commissions are still in full force. Am I right, Mike Goimarac?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Now that our highly paid upper management City Staff  controls this town &#8216;lock, stock and barrel&#8217;- with City Council&#8217;s blessings and no &#8220;pesky open meeting laws&#8221; to deal with &#8211; not to mention any &#8220;annoying transparency&#8221; &#8211; a more appropriate name for the Citizens Engagement Committee would be the Citizens Elimination Committee&#8230;.I watched too as the many outstanding speeches and pleas to Council made by our most revered citizens were completely ignored. Some Commissions needed to be eliminated, some tweaked, however, the Draconian &#8216;axing&#8217; of so many Commissions, particularly dealing with arts and history is a sad day in Sedona history&#8230; One little caveat&#8230; If I recall correctly, City Attorney Mike Goimarac said repeatedly during the meeting that the Commissions could NOT be dissolved until the Ordinances creating them were rescinded. When our Mayor Rob Adams deserted the meeting prematurely, the vote to rescind the Ordinances ended up being tied 3-3, thus resulting in defeat. Rob could have saved the Commissions right then and there with a &#8216;no&#8217; vote. So, technically, until those Ordinances are rescinded, the Commissions are still in full force. Am I right, Mike Goimarac?</p>
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		<title>
		By: gary chamberlain		</title>
		<link>https://sedonaeye.com/sedona-council-vote-based-on-poor-research-and-weak-oversight/comment-page-1/#comment-26049</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[gary chamberlain]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Aug 2013 02:35:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://sedonaeye.com/?p=32102#comment-26049</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Mike,

Thanks for your comments.

My position on bureaucrats and politicians is this, &quot;on a scale of 1-10, 10 being the best, most are at 1 (one)&quot; on my rating scale.

There have only been two town leaders who ever offered to help advance the Folksville anti litter efforts - and who recognized those who clean the highways connecting our Verde Valley communities - they are Mayor Rob Adams-Sedona, and Russ Martin-Camp Verde Town Manager.

We have never counted on town leaders to do much of anything due to their political nature and being afraid to take hard-line positions. We seem to do much better alone because “We the people” are doing it and are throwing &quot;being PC&quot; in the trash bag. Sometimes toes need to be stepped on!

Grass Roots efforts succeed or fail on their merits and we’ve made a big difference - no thanks to most politicians and bureaucrats.

Gary Chamberlain
“Point Man” FVUSA
Cornville AZ]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mike,</p>
<p>Thanks for your comments.</p>
<p>My position on bureaucrats and politicians is this, &#8220;on a scale of 1-10, 10 being the best, most are at 1 (one)&#8221; on my rating scale.</p>
<p>There have only been two town leaders who ever offered to help advance the Folksville anti litter efforts &#8211; and who recognized those who clean the highways connecting our Verde Valley communities &#8211; they are Mayor Rob Adams-Sedona, and Russ Martin-Camp Verde Town Manager.</p>
<p>We have never counted on town leaders to do much of anything due to their political nature and being afraid to take hard-line positions. We seem to do much better alone because “We the people” are doing it and are throwing &#8220;being PC&#8221; in the trash bag. Sometimes toes need to be stepped on!</p>
<p>Grass Roots efforts succeed or fail on their merits and we’ve made a big difference &#8211; no thanks to most politicians and bureaucrats.</p>
<p>Gary Chamberlain<br />
“Point Man” FVUSA<br />
Cornville AZ</p>
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		<title>
		By: Mike in the VOC		</title>
		<link>https://sedonaeye.com/sedona-council-vote-based-on-poor-research-and-weak-oversight/comment-page-1/#comment-26041</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mike in the VOC]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Aug 2013 17:00:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://sedonaeye.com/?p=32102#comment-26041</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Sorry Gary, but what do your entries have anything to do with the topic being discussed here? You seem to want to provide a character reference for the good Mayor. The fact that he has helped you in your outstanding job in cleaning up our local highways, been accessible to you, and has had luncheon meetings is just another indication that he is a smart politician. We already know that!]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry Gary, but what do your entries have anything to do with the topic being discussed here? You seem to want to provide a character reference for the good Mayor. The fact that he has helped you in your outstanding job in cleaning up our local highways, been accessible to you, and has had luncheon meetings is just another indication that he is a smart politician. We already know that!</p>
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		<title>
		By: gary		</title>
		<link>https://sedonaeye.com/sedona-council-vote-based-on-poor-research-and-weak-oversight/comment-page-1/#comment-26036</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[gary]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Aug 2013 14:44:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://sedonaeye.com/?p=32102#comment-26036</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[One more thing,

I don&#039;t know if Mayor Adams still does this or not but a one time he had regular lunch meting where anyone could come and say anything.

Mayor Adams let everyone introduce themselves and speak on any topic.

How many other Mayors do this?

Gary Chamberlain
Cornville AZ]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One more thing,</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know if Mayor Adams still does this or not but a one time he had regular lunch meting where anyone could come and say anything.</p>
<p>Mayor Adams let everyone introduce themselves and speak on any topic.</p>
<p>How many other Mayors do this?</p>
<p>Gary Chamberlain<br />
Cornville AZ</p>
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		<title>
		By: Gary Chamberlain		</title>
		<link>https://sedonaeye.com/sedona-council-vote-based-on-poor-research-and-weak-oversight/comment-page-1/#comment-26026</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Gary Chamberlain]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Aug 2013 02:17:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://sedonaeye.com/?p=32102#comment-26026</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Mayor Rob Adams is accessible and cares!

As a Sedona outsider, in 2009 I found Mayor Rob Adams accessible to me and our group efforts to rid Highway 89A between Cottonwood and Sedona of highway trash by uniting all of the Adopt-A-Highway groups on this section of highway.

When I went to Mayor Adams in 2009 asking for help in energizing the Adopt-A-Highway groups connecting this section of highway, he paved the way for me to speak before all of the Verde Valley Mayors and City Managers – he took a chance.

Even though I was very inexperienced at speaking before large groups, Mayor Adams paved the way because he appreciated the efforts of the “Road Warriors” in cleaning up Highway 89A.

In 2010, Mayor Adams requested the ADOT Adopt-A-Highway “Activity Reports” for the Adopt-A-Highway groups between Sedona and Cottonwood because he wanted to know who and what frequency the Adopt-A-Highway groups were performing – he cared enough to inquire.

In 2012 Mayor Adams and the Sedona City Council presented Folksville USA and our Adopt-A-Highway groups an award for our efforts. Mayor Adams realized clean highways are good for the Verde Valley and Sedona and he did something that meant something to us.

A few weeks ago, I sent Mayor Adams the information that he had requested to prepare a document that could be presented to all of the Verde Valley leaders with the hope of recognizing all of the individual Adopt-A-Highway groups in the Verde Valley and Sedona for their efforts on a once-per-year basis.

I have had many heated and passionate discussions with Mayor Adams over the past five years and he has always left his door open and returned my phone calls as we continue to work together.

You must know that we love all politicians and bureaucrats equally and our “Road Warriors and Folksville USA” participants never endorse anyone but we do thank those that assist with our efforts …… 

Thank you Mayor Rob Adams.

Gary Chamberlain
“Point Man” FVUSA
Cornville AZ]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mayor Rob Adams is accessible and cares!</p>
<p>As a Sedona outsider, in 2009 I found Mayor Rob Adams accessible to me and our group efforts to rid Highway 89A between Cottonwood and Sedona of highway trash by uniting all of the Adopt-A-Highway groups on this section of highway.</p>
<p>When I went to Mayor Adams in 2009 asking for help in energizing the Adopt-A-Highway groups connecting this section of highway, he paved the way for me to speak before all of the Verde Valley Mayors and City Managers – he took a chance.</p>
<p>Even though I was very inexperienced at speaking before large groups, Mayor Adams paved the way because he appreciated the efforts of the “Road Warriors” in cleaning up Highway 89A.</p>
<p>In 2010, Mayor Adams requested the ADOT Adopt-A-Highway “Activity Reports” for the Adopt-A-Highway groups between Sedona and Cottonwood because he wanted to know who and what frequency the Adopt-A-Highway groups were performing – he cared enough to inquire.</p>
<p>In 2012 Mayor Adams and the Sedona City Council presented Folksville USA and our Adopt-A-Highway groups an award for our efforts. Mayor Adams realized clean highways are good for the Verde Valley and Sedona and he did something that meant something to us.</p>
<p>A few weeks ago, I sent Mayor Adams the information that he had requested to prepare a document that could be presented to all of the Verde Valley leaders with the hope of recognizing all of the individual Adopt-A-Highway groups in the Verde Valley and Sedona for their efforts on a once-per-year basis.</p>
<p>I have had many heated and passionate discussions with Mayor Adams over the past five years and he has always left his door open and returned my phone calls as we continue to work together.</p>
<p>You must know that we love all politicians and bureaucrats equally and our “Road Warriors and Folksville USA” participants never endorse anyone but we do thank those that assist with our efforts …… </p>
<p>Thank you Mayor Rob Adams.</p>
<p>Gary Chamberlain<br />
“Point Man” FVUSA<br />
Cornville AZ</p>
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		<title>
		By: Mike in the VOC		</title>
		<link>https://sedonaeye.com/sedona-council-vote-based-on-poor-research-and-weak-oversight/comment-page-1/#comment-25996</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mike in the VOC]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 Aug 2013 02:35:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://sedonaeye.com/?p=32102#comment-25996</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I have read all of the postings under this topic, watched the August 14 Special Council Meeting, and re-read the staff reports pertaining to this meeting. In my opinion, staff has done a wonderful job in the written and verbal staff reports to suggest that the proposed Citizen Engagement Program will provide more ways for citizen participation from individuals representing a broader spectrum within our community. These individuals may not be the typical retirees who have time to spend endless hours in commission meetings without a chance to get much accomplished.  Utilizing the newest means available in the social media, more citizens will be able to contribute as committee members with fresh, innovative ideas. 

I had the impression by listening to many of the public forum presentations that as committee members the participants would have a diminished role as compared to commission members. In my opinion, aside from a title change, we would get better citizenry participation with a lesser impact on staff time.

Unfortunately, many of the present commissions have come about as patronage rewards dispensed by the Mayor. Is that why he was not willing to explain why he was reclusing himself from voting  and participating in that meeting? Is that why he had no other alternative but walk out of the meeting?

We should not be afraid to entertain using new ideas to reach out to the public to get their input. Sometimes, we get too complacent and comfortable with the old ( not unlike choosing to wear an old comfortable shoe instead of breaking-in a new pair ) and in doing so, we reject new possibilities for improving our system.

Where would our world be if we stuck only with the old and rejected any new ideas?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have read all of the postings under this topic, watched the August 14 Special Council Meeting, and re-read the staff reports pertaining to this meeting. In my opinion, staff has done a wonderful job in the written and verbal staff reports to suggest that the proposed Citizen Engagement Program will provide more ways for citizen participation from individuals representing a broader spectrum within our community. These individuals may not be the typical retirees who have time to spend endless hours in commission meetings without a chance to get much accomplished.  Utilizing the newest means available in the social media, more citizens will be able to contribute as committee members with fresh, innovative ideas. </p>
<p>I had the impression by listening to many of the public forum presentations that as committee members the participants would have a diminished role as compared to commission members. In my opinion, aside from a title change, we would get better citizenry participation with a lesser impact on staff time.</p>
<p>Unfortunately, many of the present commissions have come about as patronage rewards dispensed by the Mayor. Is that why he was not willing to explain why he was reclusing himself from voting  and participating in that meeting? Is that why he had no other alternative but walk out of the meeting?</p>
<p>We should not be afraid to entertain using new ideas to reach out to the public to get their input. Sometimes, we get too complacent and comfortable with the old ( not unlike choosing to wear an old comfortable shoe instead of breaking-in a new pair ) and in doing so, we reject new possibilities for improving our system.</p>
<p>Where would our world be if we stuck only with the old and rejected any new ideas?</p>
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		<title>
		By: Steve Black - Uptown		</title>
		<link>https://sedonaeye.com/sedona-council-vote-based-on-poor-research-and-weak-oversight/comment-page-1/#comment-25992</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Steve Black - Uptown]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 Aug 2013 00:18:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://sedonaeye.com/?p=32102#comment-25992</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Mrs. Reddington:

I had to laugh when I read your suspicions about Mrs. Thomas. 

I have never met her myself but I know of 2 people that know her well. She commutes back and forth from Washington State to Sedona and lives in the Harmony area when she&#039;s here. 

If you look at back writings on SedonaEye.com under topics dealing with SFD, you will find that Mrs. Thomas has written many times over the years to support the recall and the building of the new fire station.  So, she has not “just found” SedonaEye, she’s been around for a while. 

Thanks for whatever your contributions were to the Community Plan report. I was looking at it on line and it looks so much better than the last one. Nice graphics and photos to highlight points of importance. 

I plan on spending more time to check it out over the next few weeks.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mrs. Reddington:</p>
<p>I had to laugh when I read your suspicions about Mrs. Thomas. </p>
<p>I have never met her myself but I know of 2 people that know her well. She commutes back and forth from Washington State to Sedona and lives in the Harmony area when she&#8217;s here. </p>
<p>If you look at back writings on SedonaEye.com under topics dealing with SFD, you will find that Mrs. Thomas has written many times over the years to support the recall and the building of the new fire station.  So, she has not “just found” SedonaEye, she’s been around for a while. </p>
<p>Thanks for whatever your contributions were to the Community Plan report. I was looking at it on line and it looks so much better than the last one. Nice graphics and photos to highlight points of importance. </p>
<p>I plan on spending more time to check it out over the next few weeks.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Mrs. Rodger Thomas		</title>
		<link>https://sedonaeye.com/sedona-council-vote-based-on-poor-research-and-weak-oversight/comment-page-1/#comment-25991</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mrs. Rodger Thomas]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Aug 2013 21:16:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://sedonaeye.com/?p=32102#comment-25991</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[One does not have to be a member of city staff, council or commission to know the lingo of Sedona City Government as it’s almost the same no matter what city or town you come from, one just needs to be an intelligent and interested person.  

My only point has been that when people read your postings they should take your opinions as just that, opinions because I have now proven that they are NOT facts. 

And as you say, I’m done now, as well.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One does not have to be a member of city staff, council or commission to know the lingo of Sedona City Government as it’s almost the same no matter what city or town you come from, one just needs to be an intelligent and interested person.  </p>
<p>My only point has been that when people read your postings they should take your opinions as just that, opinions because I have now proven that they are NOT facts. </p>
<p>And as you say, I’m done now, as well.</p>
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		<title>
		By: judy		</title>
		<link>https://sedonaeye.com/sedona-council-vote-based-on-poor-research-and-weak-oversight/comment-page-1/#comment-25988</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[judy]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Aug 2013 18:25:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://sedonaeye.com/?p=32102#comment-25988</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Our Mrs. Thomas, may not be Mrs. Thomas.  She’s very knowledgeable though, much more knowledgeable than the average anonymous person who “could never afford to donate so much time to the City”.  She knows all about how “The City Manager was given the task by City Council to find a fix for the broken system”, and to ”re-listen to the video to 26:53 re-listen to the video to 26:53 , and she knows who’s on the standing committees she “read the proposed plan” (17 pages), she knows what has been “agenized”, and knows that there are “documented minutes of those meetings” (with commissioners).

She knows a lot.  I hope this person (he or she) will find a good use for their knowledge, if he or she isn’t already occupied on city staff.

Regardless Mayor Adams is a fine man.  I’ve met every councilor, and they are fine people too.  Staff, who I’ve known are really good people who we are lucky to have among us.  What we have here are correctable mistakes, I think.
I&#039;m done now...]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Our Mrs. Thomas, may not be Mrs. Thomas.  She’s very knowledgeable though, much more knowledgeable than the average anonymous person who “could never afford to donate so much time to the City”.  She knows all about how “The City Manager was given the task by City Council to find a fix for the broken system”, and to ”re-listen to the video to 26:53 re-listen to the video to 26:53 , and she knows who’s on the standing committees she “read the proposed plan” (17 pages), she knows what has been “agenized”, and knows that there are “documented minutes of those meetings” (with commissioners).</p>
<p>She knows a lot.  I hope this person (he or she) will find a good use for their knowledge, if he or she isn’t already occupied on city staff.</p>
<p>Regardless Mayor Adams is a fine man.  I’ve met every councilor, and they are fine people too.  Staff, who I’ve known are really good people who we are lucky to have among us.  What we have here are correctable mistakes, I think.<br />
I&#8217;m done now&#8230;</p>
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